Cheap-Easy & Low Tech

[KC-Bowhunter]

At least that’s how I envisioned this project when I started.

My idea was to purchase a refurbished computer, install the tuner card, download the Beyond TV software and vuaala…Free TiVo!

I wanted to start this thread to expose some of the pitfalls that I’ve learned mostly from this forum.  It’s my way of giving back.

I get the basic structure of the setup:
-  Cable splitter – to the TV and to the PVR
     -  That way I can watch TV the old fashioned way and record two additional shows
-  PVR video out back to the TV via the second TV input
-  PVR audio out to the stereo receiver and then on to the TV audio inputs

Sounds simple right?  It might be if I’d known what I was doing. 

First Pitfall – my TV has video inputs for either cable, S-video, or Component video.  My computer has either HDMI or VGA, as do most onboard graphics cards.  So you’ll need a way to convert the PC video output to match your TV.  If you have one of the newer flat screens, I understand you’ll only need a cable since they already have HDMI.  And you’ll want to understand the three types of HDMI connectors so you get it right.

I still have mine hooked to a PC monitor for testing so I can’t yet comment on success in hooking up the PVR to the TV but I think I’ve got it covered.

So first I did my homework to figure out what hardware I needed besides the computer.  Since I wanted this to be a stand-alone unit I let the hardware determine what computer I got.  I decided I wanted to be able to record one show while watching another.  To do this you need either two tuners or a dual tuner.  I opted for the Hauppauge 2250 dual tuner card that comes with the Windows compatible remote.

**Epiphany** what the literature doesn’t mention is that you don’t need two separate cable feeds to utilize the dual tuner.  It has it built in  .

**Epiphany** the 2250 comes with a conversion kit for low profile computers also know as Slimline.  That saves space, always a good thing!


Next was the computer.  The 2250 has to have a PCI Express slot available but since I was purchasing a new computer at the same time it wasn’t a problem for me.  People with older PCs with just PCI slots will want to search for a different tuner card that’s compatible.

I had predetermined that I do not know enough about computers to build my own from scratch.  All I know how to do is put a card in a slot and turn it back on    So to save money I opted to go with a refurbished computer.  That way I could save about $200, I actually saved more as I’ll explain.

So first I bought a standard tower PC, I hadn’t yet figured out that the 2250 would fit into a Slimline PC.  I get it home and it’s a refurb and the DVD doesn’t work.  Back to Micro Center, but by now I’ve discovered that it will work with a Slimline.  So I get another refurb but in Slimline.  Well I get it home and apparently the NIC is bad I can’t get on the internet, and without that you can’t get your channel guide.  Back to Micro Center.  I get now my third PC, another Slimline by Acer but the card won’t fit due the positioning of the hard drive.  Back to Micro Center…again!

But then I remembered that you can run the internet into the USB using a converter.  I asked if they still had the second PC I returned and they did.  So I repurchased the PC (they were out of Slimlines with 500GB drives) and Micro Center knocked off another $100 for the bad NIC.  I took the savings and purchased the Cat5 to USB converter.  I got it home and it all worked.  Now I was in business!

**Epiphany** if you’re going to go with a refurbished computer to save cash, stick with a bricks and mortar store if you can, you may have to return it.  Micro Center was wonderful and only 10 miles away.

So I’ve got my PC, the 2250 tuner card, and it came with a remote.  Since we don’t have Tivo I opted to try out Windows Media Center first since its free and comes with Vista preloaded.  In mockup mode it works great with all the things I wanted it to do so far in my testing.

**Pitfall** Media Center is free but in order to get the channel guide you have to let them track what you’re watching.  Lots of people on here hate that, me included, but I don’t really care as long as it works and its working great.

**Pitfall** in order to get any channel guide you’ll need the internet.  Since I’m building this as a stand-alone unit and I don’t have wireless, I put in a hub and ran some Cat5 from our office which is in the next room.  Alternatively you could go with a wireless router or a second router right there at the PC coming in from the cable.  I may actually have Time Warner send me another router to get rid of the cable at some point. Or go wireless, haven’t decided.

But hey I’m still in mockup mode so haven’t got it all hooked up yet.

I’m still trying to figure out how to get the remote to work.  I don't think I have all the drivers loaded properly and directions that come with the 2250 are atrocious.  Currently it’s a paper weight but I'm working on it.

My only complaint so far is that it takes forever to burn a DVD???  I don’t know why it should take so long, and it only fits two hours of shows and the max resolution.  In fact I recorded one at max and one at a reduced resolution or it wouldn’t fit.  The difference in quality was slight but only two hours per disk and I can see why people use larger 1TB drives instead.  And it took over an hour to record 2 hours to the DVD I'm not sure if this is normal or not since I'm new to burning DVDs that are basically full???

More to come Epiphanys and Pitfalls to come as the saga continues.

[Craig]

I enjoyed reading that.    There is definitely something wrong with the DVD burning. Either it is a very old drive that burns at 2x speed or your settings are set to 2x speed somewhere. Depending on the software you are using you should be able set the burn speed manually if you need to.

[prouton]

Regarding the DVD burning, if it's doing ANY conversion to make the recorded file format DVD compatible, then it's going to take much longer -- this is very CPU intensive.

[The Dude]

**Pitfall** in order to get any channel guide you’ll need the internet.  Since I’m building this as a stand-alone unit and I don’t have wireless, I put in a hub and ran some Cat5 from our office which is in the next room.  Alternatively you could go with a wireless router or a second router right there at the PC coming in from the cable.  I may actually have Time Warner send me another router to get rid of the cable at some point. Or go wireless, haven’t decided.

I'm not sure how your CAT5 to USB dongle effects this but you're probably going to get better transfer rates over a wired connection anyway. At the very least the signal will be more consistent. I wouldn't worry about this too much.

I remember being kind of shocked at how long it takes to burn a DVD when I built my first PVR. It is very CPU intensive (as Prouton already stated) if you are performing any kind of conversion to do so. I've also found that if you're using some type of software that has to build menus for your DVDs first this can significantly increase the amount of time that burning takes. I believe Ulead DVD, which comes with most Hauppauge cards, does this. However, I also know that when I first burned DVDs I was comparing the amount of time to the amount of time it takes to burn CDs and you do have to realize that you are burning a lot more information to a DVD and in most cases it is at a lower speed.

Is it Vista Media Center that you're using? It's been a while since we've had anyone using that around here. I'd be interested to hear how you like it when you've had some time monkey with it for a while. The restrictions aren't horrible. I think you will only see those in certain very rare circumstances. My only complaint when using XP MCE was that it was really hard to track down problems with it when something went wrong.

First Pitfall – my TV has video inputs for either cable, S-video, or Component video.  My computer has either HDMI or VGA, as do most onboard graphics cards.  So you’ll need a way to convert the PC video output to match your TV.  If you have one of the newer flat screens, I understand you’ll only need a cable since they already have HDMI.

Is that Component on your TV Component (red, green and blue connectors) or do you mean composite. Sorry if that seems obvious but a lot of people make that mistake. If you have composite that would be the most ideal connection to use. What type of video card do you have?

[Craig]

Am I living under a rock? I never had nor have I known of a DVD burning app that did some kind of conversion before it burned a disc. I've always just dragged and dropped a file that I wanted burned and it never took more than 10 min. Or maybe I'm just blessed.

[The Dude]

Am I living under a rock? I never had nor have I known of a DVD burning app that did some kind of conversion before it burned a disc. I've always just dragged and dropped a file that I wanted burned and it never took more than 10 min. Or maybe I'm just blessed.

Maybe the first one you tried just worked and/or your drive is just really fast. Some of it also depends on CPU power my newer PC is much faster at doing those things then the older one. I'm assuming you're using something like Nero Express if you're just dragging them in. Is that right?

[KC-Bowhunter]

I’m still trying to figure out how to get the remote to work.  I don't think I have all the drivers loaded properly and directions that come with the 2250 are atrocious.  Currently it’s a paper weight but I'm working on it.

So I was successful in getting the Remote to work.    I loaded the entire software disk for WinTV v7 that came with the 2250.  Initially I was thinking that the WinTV was another PVR software and that I wouldn't need it so why load it?  Another on this forum suggested I try it to rule it out and sure enough presto the remote works.  It still has issues when Vista comes out of Sleep mode but I just opted to turn sleep mode off.

Lesson learned load the full CD for the 2250.  You don't have to run the exe for WinTV but it does load the remote drivers that you need.   

That's it for now.  I'm waiting on an adaptar I ordered to be able to hook it up to the TV.

[Miller]

A good read, but I would add one more point. A forum like this is a great place to ask all of these questions before you start. Most of us have gone through these trials and tribulations and are more than willing to offer a few tips to save you some trips back and forth to the store.

One comment I would have is that it would probably be easier to keep your network using Cat5 than to ask the cable company for an additional modem.

[The Dude]

I just realized that I made the composite/component error in the post I put up there warning about that very mistake. Component would be the ideal connection for you.

[bladerunner]

use convertx2dvd to convert your files before u burn 'em.  It is faster than the rest.
use dvdshrink to remove the beginning and the end of a file, and the commercials, too if you want to wade through the file to find them. It also does compression.  I bought a vga to component (red, blue, green) cable but haven't tried it out yet.  So you arent having any trouble other than slow burn going from media center to dvd? I use ashampoo 9 to burn, it seems to work better than nero for me, and nero was my fav.